Curse

Cap'n Hoek · Jun 27, 2005, 05:13 PM // 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sentinel

But I disagree with you that a secondary monk is as effective or close to in healing as a primary monk. There is just no way. 12 healing and 12 divine favor give you 151 + 61 healing when you use Heal Other....3/4sec cast, every 3 sec..

I don't know about other combos, but my E/Mo makes an excellent healer. Sure you can heal for more with each heal as a primary monk, but how long can you sustain those 10 energy Heal Other spells with 30-40 energy as opposed to the 70-80 energy the E/Mo has? I know I've been spending a lot more time healing rather than nuking, during & post ascention.

~40% more per heal vs. ~100% more energy is pretty close, in my opinion.

Dralon · Jun 27, 2005, 05:20 PM // 17:20

If I see a group requiring a 2nd monk, I know I do not want to be part of that group, because they obviously don't know what they are doing, but rushing in and hope enough healing saves them. I agree. No mission in game requires 2 monk. And I can count on one hand the number of missions before the ring of fire I couldn't run with just the npc healer.

Drakron · Jun 27, 2005, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Underworld and Fissure do benefict from 2 monks since the mobs here hurt a lot.

Night · Jun 27, 2005, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZigZag Rollmeister

Having read some of the earlier posts here.....I find it incredibly hypocritical that the monks here would flail people for typing "Heal plz"....or "Res Plz".

You monks should know as well as anyone how many idiot newbs are out there aggroing multiple groups on missions. In fact, many of you have documented that in this very thread.

Seriously....doing missions with other players involves a certain level of anxiety since it seems like almost every group has at least ONE BAD NEWB.

So tell me monks of the world......your job is to keep the party members alive.

ARE WE TO JUST BLINDLY ASSUME THAT YOU'RE NOT THE SAME NEWB WHO AGGRO'ED ENTIRE MISSIONS WHEN YOU WERE PLAYING YOUR WARRIOR ALT?

Seriously....are ALL monks veteran, elite players?

Of course not. Even good monks can lose track of health bars sometimes.

Getting pissed because someone is telling you to perform on of your basic funcitions? Remember, it's not like telling a warrior to swing his axe. It's more like telling a warrior to attack a specific MOB. Or telling a ranger and/or mesmer to focus on interrupts.

So don't take the "Heal me plz" lines so seriously.

(I do concede though, that you've gotta be a newb if you're asking for res)

Hmm, something tells me you have yelled out, "heal plz" more than once;-). If this is case how many times have you said "elementalist please use meteor on MoB" or "Warrior please use gash on char, or hill giant". If you have never done this, why would you do this to a monk? and yes it is like telling a warrior to swing his axe as that is his basic job. If healing is not a healing monks primary job, pray tell me what is?

It has nothing to do with me being an eliteist top notch monk nor does it have anything else with the player being a newb. In fact I can say I may have heard maybe once or twice people admonishing folks who run off and aggro groups yet I hear "Res me plz" or "heal me plz" about every other 2 or 3 groups. Seriously the thing is most of us who are playing monks have played other characters. I think playing monk should be made a requirement by everyone. Maybe then they would get an idea of annoying it is.

Do I take it serious? No, I just get annoyed especially if I have kept this person alive the entire game by healing him and for some reason they now think I am not going to it. Do this for me the next PUG you get in: To each class make sure you ask them to do their job by saying "Warriors use your adrenaline skills", "Elementalist use AoE skills or lightning skills", "Ranger shoot arrows oh and include either poison arrow or iginte arrows please", "Mesmer use backfire and conjure phanthom." After doing that a few times please take a screen shot of the responses from your group as I am curious to what they will say and post them here please.

The "heal plz" isn't as annoying as the fool who runs off from the group constantly finally get his butt handed to him and yells out, "OMG why didn't you heal me?"

Rainek · Jun 27, 2005, 06:27 PM // 18:27

My first character is a Ranger and i have seen some really suicidal warriors lol, but just the other day with my warrior i witnessed a suicidal Monk. Was the funniest thing. He/she would aggro everything drag it back not waiting for group. All i have to say is goodthing he/she was a good healer hehe. I mean its not like i wasnt going to tank myself, the person was just a rusher, maybe he/she was a warrior to start. Was a new one for me, got a good laugh out of it.

drowningfish999 · Jun 27, 2005, 06:56 PM // 18:56

I have to admit that my 3rd char., a warrior,is very tempting to charge out and rush with. Maybe it's because its my 3rd time running through everything with him, but I agree that some people really have problems. Even I can control my mouse button-happy finger when it's important.

Back on the topic of monks. I get lots of abuse with my primary healer. Most people are usually good natured about it, they die and don't say anything, or at least just say something like "dang, my bad." and keep the blame on themselves. Then I rez them, they say thanks, and we continue on. However, some people will just go crazy if I let someone die, no matter what they are doing. I've had a E/something who thought he was a tanked a rush EVERY group head on. Then when he finally died, hes all yelling and blaming me etc.

ZigZag Rollmeister · Jun 27, 2005, 06:58 PM // 18:58

Quote:

Hmm, something tells me you have yelled out, "heal plz" more than once;-). If this is case how many times have you said "elementalist please use meteor on MoB" or "Warrior please use gash on char, or hill giant". If you have never done this, why would you do this to a monk? and yes it is like telling a warrior to swing his axe as that is his basic job. If healing is not a healing monks primary job, pray tell me what is?

Actually, I've never once asked for a heal. My problem here is that this thread makes it sound like all monks are good players, and it's simply not true. So you can't expect everyone to say : "OMG it's a monk, he MUST know what he's doing? And when my health is almost at zero, while everyone elses havent even budged from full, then we'll just assume that our beloved monk is paying attention and heals me before I die. (On the next hit)"

Are you trying to tell me that monks never get distracted in battle and stop looking at health bars for a few seconds?

Commander Ryker · Jun 27, 2005, 07:24 PM // 19:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarrant

It's to the point now I just grab 7 henches and go; I'm sick of the whole group-forming scene as it has become.

Me too.

Part of the problem, as I see it, is people are forming groups for every freaking quest. The only time I even attempt to form a group, is for the missions, everything else, I grab some henchies. If people would stop forming groups for every little quest, there'd be more monks and what ever for the big missions.

Sentinel · Jun 27, 2005, 08:51 PM // 20:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cap'n Hoek

I don't know about other combos, but my E/Mo makes an excellent healer. Sure you can heal for more with each heal as a primary monk, but how long can you sustain those 10 energy Heal Other spells with 30-40 energy as opposed to the 70-80 energy the E/Mo has? I know I've been spending a lot more time healing rather than nuking, during & post ascention.

~40% more per heal vs. ~100% more energy is pretty close, in my opinion.

Valid point Cap. I often feel envious of the gobles or energy the Els have but let's take a closer look at this:

Primary healer with 12 at divine favor and 12 at healing:
I first hit Divine boon (monk's exclusive) so now I have +61 heal
added for every spell while I loose only 2 energy.
I save the Heal Other only for emergencies myself.
I usualy use these:

1.orizon of healing for +60
2.Dwayna's kiss for +51 +17 for each ench.
3.healing breeze for 8 pips of health reg. for 10 secs

All 3 cost 5 energy, 1 sec casting and 2-3 sec recharge...highly spammable.

In the heat of battle a 60 + 61 every 2 secs goes a longer way than just 60.
With the 121 total you'll be able to move down on the other health bar needing your attention. But with the 60 you'll need to cast something else, soon, propably immediatly after.

Who is the most effective healer? In long battles against high damage mobs I'll run out of energy faster than you but my group will be in top shape when I run out. Your group might be panicking while you strugle to keep them alive with a 60 there and a 50 here and so on. In battles against inferior mobs it doesn't realy matter, does it? I can manage my energy bar to sustain the battle indefinetly and for you it's a non issue.

It's still debatable but for me a healer that's a ?/Mo is a waste of a primary proffesion any way you look at it. And that goes double for Es who instead of being major damage dealers they are reduced to healers on wellfare...lol

Btw..an E/? will be my 3rd toon so I might change my mind by then....

Sent.-

Night · Jun 27, 2005, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZigZag Rollmeister

Actually, I've never once asked for a heal. My problem here is that this thread makes it sound like all monks are good players, and it's simply not true. So you can't expect everyone to say : "OMG it's a monk, he MUST know what he's doing? And when my health is almost at zero, while everyone elses havent even budged from full, then we'll just assume that our beloved monk is paying attention and heals me before I die. (On the next hit)"

Are you trying to tell me that monks never get distracted in battle and stop looking at health bars for a few seconds?

Why wouldn't you think "OMG hes a monk and he must know what he is doing" provided you took the time to figure out that they are a healing monk? When you take in a warrior, do you expect he knows what is doing or do you expect him to go sit in the rear and cast elemental spells? Yes there are bad monks just like there are bad warriors and bad rangers and my point is in every group I have been in, I have yet to hear anyone complain about the jobs other classes are doing in game usually but they will still yell at a monk during a game.

Well i can only attest for myself and say yes I am saying healing Monks don't get distracted in battle and stop looking at health bars. There are 3 times when a monk will ever stop looking at a person health bar 1) He/she is getting beat down and no assistance is forth coming therefore they are saving their own skin 2) He/she is healing someone else or has no mana to which to heal with. 3) The monk has been healing the suicidal player who continually splits off from the group or runs ahead to go head to head when the beasties and finally decides the kamikaze serves the team best by staying dead. In my experience not being a monk, I have yet to ask a monk for a heal because I assume its his/hers job.

Further more, there are times in which a monk has to choose who to heal in case of dire emergencies. Yes as a healing monk I watch everyone's life bar. Due energy management, I am not going to heal you as soon as you take 1 point of damage but rather right around the 50 - 70 % of life bar if you are taking constant damage to a) conserve mana and b) max usefulness of healing (divine favor +divine boon + heal spell. I get between the 3 somewhere around 115 or so healing points). Some think because they use their heal before I do, I am not doing my job. No, I have to keep everyone alive not just 1 person. If you heal yourself before I do, I am not going spam heals on you or ask you to stop healing.

Have you ever seen a warrior get distracted and stop attacking mobs for any length of time? Nope. For me in every case that someone has yelled for a heal, they do it the second they get hit and those that yell res do so with a few secs of death and don't realize I can not take the time to res them during battle and a res spell can take several seconds which for some reason they don't get either.

Again, I am not saying every monk knows what they are doing nor are we saying all monks are good players. Tell me how many times have you told another class or seen another outside of a monk to do their job? I haven't. I have seen "be careful. don't pull too many mobs at once". No one here has yet to say it. What we are saying is why is the monk class the only one asked to his or hers job and that it is annoying when folks do that. Do me a favor and play as a monk. You will then see how quick some folks are at yelling out "heal me" or "Res me".

Cap'n Hoek · Jun 27, 2005, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sentinel

Who is the most effective healer? In long battles against high damage mobs I'll run out of energy faster than you but my group will be in top shape when I run out. Your group might be panicking while you strugle to keep them alive with a 60 there and a 50 here and so on. In battles against inferior mobs it doesn't realy matter, does it? I can manage my energy bar to sustain the battle indefinetly and for you it's a non issue.

It's still debatable but for me a healer that's a ?/Mo is a waste of a primary proffesion any way you look at it. And that goes double for Es who instead of being major damage dealers they are reduced to healers on wellfare...lol

Well, my set up normally includes Word or Healing, Healing Breeze and Heal Other. Then I wait for someone to hit <50% health, cast WoH, the Heal Other just after. That's ~250 healing in a few seconds for 15 energy. And for incidental damage I have breeze. Not exactly welfare.

But still, you're right. I don't get to play meteor shower with my new found friends too often when I'm healing. Although when you have a party full of damage dealers and are stuck without a monk, it works out ok.

KaPe · Jun 27, 2005, 11:27 PM // 23:27

There's one thing E/Mo's don't have. Runes. Superior Healing + Superior Divine makes your spells *much* better as a monk. Then again, -150hp is a lot, so it's better to just get superior + minor.

Sagius Truthbarron · Jun 27, 2005, 11:32 PM // 23:32

I enjoy it when I see a Necromancer, Ele, or Warrior storm into the battle, get themselves killed and then scream "OMG group sux". Usualy the aggroing ( To both player and AI alike) Warrior or Necromancer is usualy the one to be screaming about the monk.

I'm not entirely guilt free here. One mission at Thunderhead keep, we had two monks, one was Prot and the other claimed to be Healing. Well, at the first mob of three beastmasters one player dies, others are severly injured.

Prot monk: Hey, so-and-so, can you heal?

Healer monk: Yah, I have 20 healing.

Sagius: What? How do you get 20 healing?

Healer Monk: Runes

Sagius: Do you have any Divine favor?

Healer Monk: no

Sagius: What do you have?

Healer Monk: Air magic.

Ok, is it wrong to be semi-mad at this kind of monk? Sure, they may be smiting or something, and it must be pretty hard getting a group as a Smiting Mo/e, but do you really have to lie(?) about it?

I sometimes do the "My health is x-480" thing when I've gone some time without healing and my health is low. I sometimes do the "I'm Dead!" or "Sagius Truthbarron is dead!" thing when I'm dead, and I also do it when other players die, but mostly in PvP. Mainly suggesting that I have a res signet.

I've never cursed out the monk before, I have, however said to the new monk after we fail previous mission things to the extent of "Hey, a monk that knows how to heal!

".

I've only had two bad expirence with being a monk, and that is at the HoH.

Once, a Korean team stormed us, poisened everyone, the other monk was buffing everyone while I tried to cure the diesse and give healing breeze to the players dying from it. I died within 45 seconds to a hammer-knock-down-spammer - "MONK HEAL" -
Me: "I'm dead!"

*Soand So raises me*

*Dies*

*Res again*

Players (1-6) "I'm dead!" "Res me!!!" "RES OTHER MONK"

"MONK SUX" "REDUE BOOT MONK"

Ok, scenario 2:

1v1 American team in the Underwold.

*Battles rage for 3 minutes, blue team, mine advances to the enemy*

A W/x and a N/x rush me with army of Minions and trap me in a corner, unable to move, forced to heal myself.

"where monk"

*Calls targets and pings on cornering warrior and necro*

"I'm trapped!"

"WTF MONK CALL WARRIOR TARGETS"

"MONK DUN CALL NOOB"

"But I'm trapped"

"MONK SUCKS"

"monk suxx"

"GHEY NOOB MONK"

*Dies*

*Party dies*

"NOOB MONK FIND NEW MONK NOT NOOB MONK BUT MONK"

"k"

*Boot*

Oh, yah, on topic: Yes, monks are hard to find.

Ensign · Jun 27, 2005, 11:49 PM // 23:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZigZag Rollmeister

My problem here is that this thread makes it sound like all monks are good players, and it's simply not true.

Hahah, definitely. I helped a PUG through Dragon's Lair last night, and the other monk on the team didn't do anything other than cast a level 0 Heal Party every once in a while. There are terrible players of every profession...

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZigZag Rollmeister

Are you trying to tell me that monks never get distracted in battle and stop looking at health bars for a few seconds?

I don't think that's the intention at all, but that telling the monks to heal is about as useful as telling the warriors to hit things with weapons. If they're not, there's either something wrong that they aren't communicating, or they're so out of it that yelling for heals isn't going to help. If it's the former case, you're just pissing off your monk, and if it's the latter case you're wasting your time.

If you notice a Monk just standing there doing nothing it makes sense to ask him what's going on, but that's not any different from any other profession.

Peace,
-CxE

Lampshade · Jun 27, 2005, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Monks hold a lot of power.
Once a guy was being a jerk when I was forming a PUG and so I said "Stfu or I wont heal or rez you"

Silence.........

Osangar · Jun 28, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taphoo

Any decent group can finish any of the quests/missions I have played (up to Druids Overlook). I can't respond about anything beyond that (duh

. They are not that difficult with teamwork and competant players - the Beta missions were much harder.

I form PUGs just by calling out how many bodies I need - I'm not terribly worried about what classes respond. And the ones that drop when they see no monk - didn't need them anyway.

If you *really* feel you need a monk, grab the NPC healer - again, a good group can even keep her alive...

That just wont work in later missions. Try doing Fire Isle runs with no healer in group..heh...then you'll also LOVE to have your Hench healers standing in lava while trying to heal the group and themselves...or rush in after your puller just to get killed. Now it's not to say that the end game missions cant be done with henches...it can...it's just a real pain in the ass to do because they ARE stupid.

Laizness · Jun 28, 2005, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Healing monks bring healing breeze in tombs...?

raptor-razor · Jun 28, 2005, 02:17 AM // 02:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Night

"

3) Of the pugs I have done, only one group actually thanked me for keeping them alive as it was quite an adventure to say the least. This group was the least experienced from what I could tell but did their best. An occasional misstep but nothing too bad we couldn't recover from. My more seasoned groups though seem to be a different animal.
"

I did and completed Thunderhead keep as the sole monk in a team of 8 (no henchie monks)... and by the time we ended up in ember light camp, no one had even acknowledged, much less thanked me for the healing. This, after I was forced to run back and forth between the two doors because the team split into two.

Why would anyone want to be a monk?

ZhaoYun · Jun 28, 2005, 02:35 AM // 02:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alathys Tylderaan

From the current playerbase on the English Districts on EU server, it's quite easy to see why there are less and less monks.

It's hard to play monk, because you constantly have to keep an eye on your party's health meters, and if you slip up, it wont be long til one of the arrogant people in your PUG decides to tell you that you suck.

I fully agree with this. It is so frustrated for being a monk. Typical line I always get while playing with my pal are :-

1. Why you run away when I was fighting a group of monster ?
Answer :- How you not notice when a warrior like you are fighting a group of monsters, there are two running pass you towards me ?

2. You are good in dying.
Answer :- Yes, because you anggro two groups of monster at one time.

3. You are afraid of dying.
Answer :- Yes, I am, for the benifits of the team. Who are you going to shout "rez me" when you get killed and no one except me in the team carry unlimited "rez" ?

4. Why you need so many breaks in-between ?
Answer :- Because my father don't create this game and Arena.net says, healing spells need time to cast and recharge.

Last but not least, and it seems to be the most popular one

WHY YOU NEVER HEAL ME !
Answer :- Refer to all the above.

Of course not every warrior/ranger are idiots, but I do encounter too many of them.

Mormegil · Jun 28, 2005, 03:09 AM // 03:09

Even in PvE you'll find monk templates.

1- Noob Healer (opposite of the boon healer).

This guy will overheal you in the first ten seconds of the fight to show he's good. You'll lose 20 life and be healed for 80-100 hp every time. The problem is, he'll run out of mana sooner or later. When that happens, your whole group will be gang-banged horribly, and no-one will ever know what happened, because the monk will come up with something like "I was backfired", "cant stand those friggin mesmers" and so on.

2- Protozoic Monk

This guy just discovered that protecting others is a noble task and its darn cool as well. He'll cast random prot spells here and there, doesnt matter if you're actually fighting or you're up a hill, calm and relaxed, wanding the enemy, while the Ele is being raped.

3- The Professional

This man immediately becomes the grp leader. He calls targets, he points you in the right direction and, while fighting, he gives you useless info on monsters while bragging about his legendary deeds in PvE/PvP. His nemesis are the "guild mates": mysterious and powerful guys who, apparently, always need the IMMEDIATE help of the Professional while he's about to finish a 40min+ quest with your group. Needless to say, the Professional won't give a damn about your wasted time.